Good day everyone,
A few notes here regarding WGs thoughts on the latest Sandbox results:
Stage 1
In the first stage, WG changed the shot distribution within the aiming circle, this was an an attempt to curb the amount of ‘lucky’ shots at weakpoints and critical modules while on the move or not fully aimed in. In that aim, the change was succesful, medium tanks did 20-25% less damage than on the live server, with heavies and TDs seeing less damage done as well. The amount of ‘lucky’ shots also saw a considerable decrease. However, it also negativly affected shots by players who were stopped and fully aimed in, so it has been decided that this change will not move to the live game. WG will look into alternative methods after further reviewing.
Changes made to penetration over distance, with the hope of letting slower and more heavily armed machines close the distance of engagment, failed to make any of the anticipated changes. WG will likely look into balancing the various ammunition types to achieve this in the future, after a more thorough analysis.
Buffing the alpha damage of 120mm guns was well recieved by players. WG will look into it more thoroughly to see how this change affects overall balance.
Most changes made to large caliber guns will need to be reworked. While some machines such as the JgdPz. E-100 were fine, other machines had been too negativly impacted, such as British TDs and their HESH ammunition.
Stage 2
The stun mechanice (and its changes mid-way through the test) have been well recieved by players and WG has found that its had the desired affect in battle. WG will look to further improve the mechanic for further testing.
UI changes regarding the stun mechanic have also been well recieved, substantially increasing the interaction between players and their teams artillery and allowing them to respond to changes in the battle much quicker.
Reusable equipment was (no surprise) very well recieved, making the middle and later pglhases of the battle more dynamic. This mechanic will be further refined for the next testing phase.
And also no surprise, the new limit of 3 SPGs per team has been well recieved by both arty players (who are no longer competing for damage) and players of other classes, even though there has been an increase in wait times for arty players.
Testing will continue until the 27th. Accuracy and pen mechanics will continue being tested during this phase, hopefully providing more data for WG to make changes, and the new mechanics will now be tested on a greater variety of machines.
WHO CARES !!!!!! : even though there has been an increase in wait times for arty players.
How is arty suppose to complete the 2000 damage mission if WG nerfs the shit out of our damage..
They already telled us that the missions will be reworked for that step
the missions will get revamped completely for arty and some arty dependent missions for other classes.
By..Oh..I dunno. Maybe….Yaknow….Could be…Changing the mission parameters for arty specifically? Could be yaknow…..Maybe…. :/
Missions will be adjusted.
they should adjust LT missions too once the TX LTs are out
As already said earlier the missions will be reworked too probably incorporating assisted damage.
Buffing 120mm guns was well received? Why? Do people not realize this just makes auto-loading 120mm tanks even better? As if they weren’t already dominant as hell?
need to d something with the 120mm.. as it is now, 1 in 3 actually find their mark a majority of the time.
They will probably just nerf them to have only 3 shots.
The 120mm alpha buff really only worked because of the accuracy nerf which decreased the chances of autoloaders getting their full clip potential in the first place. The two balanced one another out. I would presume that any new introduction would have to come with a change to autoloader accuracy or a better accuracy rework plan.
But really, the longer reload on autoloaders made it easier to kill them when they were clipping and forced them to fight with the support of their team mates more often.
One way of doing it would be to nerf the time between shots. This way those tanks would find it difficult to unload without taking damage themselfs. Also nerfs to magazinereload would reduce their effectiveness. Currently 120mm guns are stupidly similar to 105mm guns.Bringing them in line with their russian 122mm brothers is much better imo.
120mm gun chance was “well received” according to WG? I guess WG definition of well received is people screaming at them for the entirety of the sandbox server.
*Sigh* OP Autoloader buff incoming.
The 120mm alpha buff really only worked because of the accuracy nerf which decreased the chances of autoloaders getting their full clip potential in the first place. The two balanced one another out. I would presume that any new introduction would have to come with a change to autoloader accuracy or a better accuracy rework plan.
But really, the longer reload on autoloaders made it easier to kill them when they were clipping and forced them to fight with the support of their team mates more often.
I don’t know about you, but if you base your statistics only on what people say then you get the trump presidency. The only people who were complaining where those who didn’t play the sandbox and saw how difficult it was to get your full clip potential.
“WG will likely look into balancing the various ammunition types to achieve this in the future, after a more thorough analysis.”
WG, you are not considering to nerf premium ammo, arent you?
I was about to say something similar. If so HalleF’inglujah !!! though this is WG so its probably a nerf to standard ammo types.
The fact that they still have to ‘analyse’ it amazes me and gives me little hope for a solution, actually…
I think this 120mm alpha change is bullshit, we need different reload times in the game to make it diverse, if you put all T10 heavy tanks on pretty much same reload then what’s the point? no one gets to break the ice
Plus autoloader burst damage gets insane, that’s why it is well received as it makes them insanely OP. Point with 400 alphaa on autoloaders was that you were able to counter them if you find a good position to trade 1 for 1 shot. In such case tanks with better alpha such as hulldown IS-7 or even side-scraping E-100 could prevent autoloader from doing a decent trade (eg, take 1 shot, give 3 or 4).
now you cannot do that, autoloaders are even able to trade well in such conditions which was so far considered a no-go situation.
Straight buff for autoloaders, I wonder why this change was well received….
Probably not enough negativity towards it. I’m honestly fine with it, as the FV215b 120 still has a shorter reload…albeit not as short anymore.
Good to see they’re actually taking the feedback into account, though. The arty mechanics being well received should be of no surprise to a lot of us.
Most tanks that run the 120mm have poor armor (T110E5 will get nerfed soon) so they have better rate of fire and gun handling to compensate. The more heavily armored 122mm using tanks have worse gun handling and slower reloads. The diversity is there, you need to give some more specific examples.
The autoloader burst damage was not insane, it was a marginal clip boost of 160 alpha and normally you would only have a clip potential of 1320 or 880 because you would miss a shot or two with the accuracy nerf every complaining person seems to forget about. The longer reload on these autoloaders also allowed for an easier kill when they were clipping which was a major problem with the T57 Heavy.
Otherwise, I would agree if they only increased the alpha damage of autoloaders it would be a straight buff, we will see what changes they had in mind with the alpha increase.
If arty get’s the stun mechanic, what about the FV304 and Bishop?
So, New autoloader playstyle.
1 wreck someone
2 be useless for eternity
But hey, tomatoes averaging 1600 dmg in t57 heavy will now do 1760! Yay!
With the accuracy changes everyone hated so much, that clip potential was 1320 or 880…. I didn’t know autoloaders had perfect accuracy and were immune to the sandbox changes….
Otherwise, if they only did increase the alpha damage, yeah, that’s a buff, but you tunnel vision and forget the bigger picture…
Huh, I agree on these things, apart from the 120mm autoloader shit. AMAZING !
autoloaders don’t have laser guns, they miss shots just like everyone else. The alpha increase in the sandbox meant that they would do 1320 or 880 clip potential rather than 1200 or 800. The longer reload also helped take out autoloaders more easily.
I loved all these changes while playing the sb server, the only thing I think its a bit op is the 440 alpha for the 120mm guns, the ideal dmg imo would be around 410~420 dmg.
Like these changes or not, I think it’s just good to hear feedback. One of the biggest issues with this game, at least as I’ve found, is that WG is constantly presenting the player base with grand ideas of how to improve the game, testing them, and then either dumping them in or letting them vanish without explanation. For those of us not on the Test Servers or Sandbox, it’s nice to see at least some sort of reasoning behind their decision making.
All that being said, I think there’s a lot of good stuff on the way. If nothing else, with Armored Warfare dying a slow, vodka-scented death, there will be plenty for WG to shamelessly rip off! 😀
“The amount of ‘lucky’ shots also saw a considerable decrease. However, it also negativly affected shots by players who were stopped and fully aimed in”
>no fucking shit when you nerf accuracy people hit less. If WG is paying people to make this kind of discovery no wonders they get short on money. WG instead of spamming premium tanks just fire the morons who have this kind of revelations ; you’ll get as much profit without pissing off players.
“WG will likely look into balancing the various ammunition types to achieve this in the future”
>If you ask people to choose between a nerfed ammo and the still OP “autopen” gold ammo they’ll pick the gold, and you’ll have nothing but more gold spam, definitely not armor buffs. Again, why did it take so long to understand that.
“British TDs and their HESH ammunition.”
>I swear to god if HESH still exists after a global “rebalance” when the goal was to nerf high damage shots…
“Reusable equipment was (no surprise) very well recieved, making the middle and later pglhases of the battle more dynamic. This mechanic will be further refined for the next testing phase.”
>I hope by “refined” you mean it wont be as pay to win as it was. Because now not only did we have the gold ammo problem where people who can afford large amounts of it have a huge advantage over others and break the balance ; we also got the consumable that if you can afford you can use 1/3 times faster ; and now that med kits also remove stuns, having the large one is pretty much a must because between the many dead crews and stun the small one cant be enough. In fact a 4th consumable slot would almost be needed…
Also no words on how arty players reacted on the fact that their damage have been reduced by half while their reload and accuracy have barely been buffed (still takes ages to aim, still not hitting what we aim at) ; and their profitability is still as low. Considering currently arty cannot make credits unless perfect game ; I dont even want to imagine how it will be after being able to do half as much in battle.
Anyway looking forward for more. The arty part seems to be getting somewhere finaly. However the armor part… Oh boy… Some people really need to be fired for WoT to have a chance to improve. If it takes them many years and two sandbox tests to understand that gold needs rework and adding more rng to accuracy wont improve gameplay ; how can we trust them in making a global rebalance.
And we’re still only at tier X. How will you do for lowtier tanks that have either horrific accuracy or terrible ammo already ? What works on tier X may and will not work at lower tiers.
Too long of a post, took forever to read and far too many disconnected points to respond to individually. Look man, finish high school and come back here when you’ve taken an internship at a laboratory or pharmacy. I know being breast fed until your 20-30’s is acceptable with the trump administration and your mother loves you, but sometimes you just gotta stand up for yourself and make a change to see the bigger picture.
There were things I agreed with and ideas I disagreed with that you said. Most of which just boils down to the sandbox is a sandbox which exists for the most unique testing purposes. If it were the supertest or god forbid the public test. Yeah, burn down wargaming’s HQ. Otherwise, realize the sandbox and test server are not the same thing, otherwise they wouldn’t waste the time creating an entirely separate server. Any company worth their salt will allocate funds to testing purposes and believe it or not, your vision of a game is not the one and true perfect vision. There are a lot of people with a lot of ideas and you just need to stop believing you are so god damn perfect.
Wouldnt increasing dispersion. On the move fix lucky snap shots? Why change rng…
Arty can’t target 75% of most maps so basically sell your arty and put crews to use in other vehicles. Better yet focus on the preferred meta “russian meds” b/c we all know how balanced those piles of trash are….
wow. wg have good reasoning. thats new
“WG will likely look into balancing the various ammunition types to achieve this in the future, after a more thorough analysis.”
This is why the Belarusians at WG are stuck making video games. They deserve to be born into a country notorious for human rights violations. Premium shells have been a serious problem for a while but now WG realizes, “huh, I guess these troglodytes might be on to something…” Sure, we “children” bitch a lot but sometimes the parents are wrong.
Hi Rita and thank you for making my morning with this article. I laughed quite a lot while reading it. I was part of the testers of the 1st stage and in my opinion the experience was so frustrating regarding the use of meds that I decided not to keep testing. I apologize in advance for the “stronk language” but it was nothing more than an attempt to make the russian heavies more retard proof they already are. When you bounce off an entire clip of 105 mm shells from a BC 25T off the side of an IS-7 at 400 m … well … yeah. Only hope was to dab the “2key” as usual and losing the potential credit earning at the end of the game. The consequence was also to turn the game into some Call of Duty tank edition with meds closing the distance and getting shot at low range by the heavies. The ambush, long distance shots were becoming meaningless. No brain needed any more … final goal achieved. Regarding the artillery … 3 arties limit per battle well received by players. Oh wait ? does that mean that 2 arties or ( let’s keep dreaming of 1 arty limit per battle) could be even better received ? what about no arty at all ? Has Wargamig finally understood after 6 years that arty is hated in this game ? That the current arty mechanic is complete bullshit? The stun mechanic is a great thing but in my opinion, they should push the effort by not allowing users to use the battle assistant mod any longer. Everything that could potentially discourage players from playing SPG’s should be tried by Wargaming as it is not and will never be skill requiring unlike the other types of tanks. Finally regarding the super TD’s like the JPZ E100 and FV 215B 183, I think these 2 tanks are already balanced. The JPZ is truly a mediocre tank, usually cursed by RNG, it has no mobility and the premium rounds make his armour pretty much useless anyway. It is all about the gun and the gun itself is crap, with no accuracy, long aim time. I personally consider the E100 once it’s pen will be buffed to be more competitive than this thing. The 183 is already balanced even if it can one shot tanks with little armour, the long reload and low dpm of this tank make it hard to use on many maps. It is a big vulnerable target. It can not find itself isolated and requires some brain to be used efficiently.
Increase in armour efficiency of heavies against tanks is their target, so artillery will have to stay in the game, just to make sure heavies that camp in strong locations don’t stay there for the entire match, farming and blocking damage.
Wasn’t ALTERNATIVE aim provided by battle assistant mod going to be added to the vanilla client?
Playing arty does require skill. Just picking the right target to fire at is a lot of thinking (and thankfully, the only purpose of thinking). Killing the low health heavy, or do more damage to a healthy one? Take the risk of missing a shot to shoot at a medium moving at moderate speed like a Pershing, or play safe and shoot at a heavy instead? Other stuff such as looking at the minimap is also important. Otherwise you will be on a reload when other tanks charge in, instead of getting a chance to (hopefully) shotgun the threat?
JgPz E100’s mediocre? Just dont get close and hide the lower plate. Enemies cant get a good shot easily if you stay far enough. Wiggling your hull makes slamming premium rounds into the superstructure hard and ineffective. Bad gun? I won’t call anything that can shave half of the HP from other tier 10s weak, even if it is terrible in every other aspect (ISU I’m looking at you), which it isn’t.
The 183 is like arty, doing huge damage and sometimes killing full health tier 10s. The only difference is that you can take revenge by shooting back immediately, which I think is why the 183 received less hate than arty.
We said in the Sandbox 1 & 2 go ahead WG and do your dumbed down retarded Penetration and Damage mechanics, and make it a brawling only game if you dare?
and ~ we likely most players will stop playing or worse maybe uninstall and play other games instead
they listened!
So all Sandbox new dumber ideas are rejected and so no changes (surprise!
what a waste of time WG, seriously like why?
however Sandbox SPG for Artillery was a success in general
most players were positive (in general) Stun was a little long for Mediums but stun is 100% better than the current meta meme of Arty 1 shots a T10 tank right back to the garage from outer space with a lazy casual click
Heat is problematic for vehicles which rely on armor to do their job?You dont say WG………….
Really now WG,you encouraged stat-whores to go full prem ammo cuz obviously bouncing 1/8 shots is bad for their WN8,you encouraged bad players to go full prem ammo cuz who the fuck has time to learn weakspots or learn how to flank,you encouraged insecure kiddos to go full prem ammo cuz rerolling and pretending to be purple after 4k battles wouldnt be possible else,and at the same time you encouraged players to grind Heavy tank lines with great armor values and impressive thicknesses,for their armor only to melt away just by pressing “2” key.Ofc you didnt realize that this brings dissapointment,frustration and toxicity in the game.
Its a great day today,cuz for the first time after 5 years playing this game,you aknowledge that problem officially,and i hope you gonna do something about it.
They’re not going to touch them for a while. Knowing the kind of business practices they engage in, they’ll beat around the bush and find something else to experiment with. If WG were to balance premium shells, then they’d lose a lot of the “good” players, aka top clans and top players because they can’t spam anymore.
Belarusian people are naturally stupid for their kind, especially WG. Acknowledgement is one thing but that doesn’t mean they’ll do anything about it. (Look at the E-25…)
With reusable consumables meds will be op. I already see autoloaders 60km/h with no armor taking a detour to reload and fix himself in order to pop on blind or 15s-reload HT. Now 25hp autoloaders near the end of the battle are pretty much damaged this or the other way around, not at full capacity. With new changes even after getting dozen of penetrating HEs you still can end the game with full crew and modules… Add to that arty pen and dmg nerf due to “splash mode”, which does not affect reload of autoloaders and here you have it, autoloaders being as bold as never since even T92 won’t do much harm to them. Armor in WOT becoming more and more useless.
I am very concerned that the changes being considered for arty and being tested in Sandbox are not fair or equitable from an arty players POV. In addition, the current changes nerf arty so badly that it will no longer be fun to play. I am not absolutely against the idea of buffing arty accuracy & rate of fire in exchangefir doing less direct damage. It is true that the current system of being at the mercy of RIDICULOUS swings in accuracy is maddening….it makes me wonder if I have any skill at all or is it just Wargaming ALLOWING me to do well certain games and then NOT ALLOWING me to do well other games. The wild swings from being able to blast every tank I see to missing shot after shot after shot (and usually at the worst possible moments in a battle) is like rolling dice and that sucks. I want to know that if I am skilled enough and knowledgable enough to get myself into positions where I can CONSISTENTLY find targets of opportunity, that my skill and experience and map knowledge will be REWARDED with consistent ability to do damage to enemy tanks. Any changes to arty that can accomplish this would be a positive development. However, if the price of that change is that arty becomes nothing but an annoying mosquito, rather than a dangerous threat, then the changes will ruin game play for arty players. Any “stun” mechanic for arty must have TEETH. Arty must not just have a bark, it must have a BITE. If the stun simply causes a slight degradation in crew performance, then the about of arty to get damage credit via team mates becomes a joke. If a tank gets stunned, it should be NON-functional for a predetermined set of time. The more times the tank gets stunned, the longer it is not functional. So maybe if a tank gets stunned once, it is not functional for 5 seconds. If it gets stunned again, 7 seconds. Stunned a third time, 10 seconds and so on. That would allow teammates a chance to inflict damage that arty would get credit for. Another approach would be gradual functionality degradation. Stunned once, gun doesn’t work for 5 seconds. Stunned twice, gun and mobility eliminated for 5 seconds. 3rd time, gun & mobility eliminated for 10 seconds, etc. This approach will reward good tankers and tankers who learn from their mistakes (out in the open, not moving, staying stationary, etc) and appropriately punish incompetent tankers. WOT should not be in the business of ENABLING poor players to remain that way at the expense of honest arty players. And what happens if I do my job as arty and stun tank after tank after tank but I have team mates who are unable to follow up on my handy work? What credit do I get for doing my job while they DID NOT do theirs? And do you know how many times I give direction to my team mates and they IGNORE IT? Constantly. So,you think,these tankers, who all hate arty, are going to care about helping me, protecting me and working in concert with me? HA! That may happen in a Sandbox, but it sure as hell IS NOT going to happen in publics. Another point of contention with a stun effect that simply does a slight decrease in crew performance concerns direct attacks on arty. I’m sure you are aware that in real warfare, any tank that took a direct hit from a large-calibre arty shell would be completely disabled. If the tank wasn’t completely destroyed then at the very least the crew would be unconscious or dead. As it stands now, arty stands little chance of survival when rushed by tanks 1 on 1. I recently hit a medium tank direct broad-side with my M53/55 at a distance of about 10 yards. This 8″ howitzer shell only did 400 damage and then he killed me while I waited 25 seconds for reload. That is UNREALISTIC NONSENSE! In any new scenario for arty, you MUST give us a chance to defend ourselves in a realistic and fair manner. A stun of an on rushing tank that simply makes the crew slightly slower is NOT FAIR. The tank coming in had ALL of the advantages at his disposal. If I am skilled enough to get off a shot that hits the tank DIRECTLY at 200 yards or less, that tank should be destroyed. You think that is too harsh? Fine. Then make the tank completely disabled for 30 seconds orb whatever time it would take for arty to reload and/or run a safe distance away. That is FAIR and it would act as a DETERRENT to players who unrealistically rush through enemy lines with the intent of killing all the arty. That rarely happened in real warfare. If arty becomes a frequent hitter due to a buff of accuracy and rate of fire, strategy will be to attack arty more often. You MUST give us a fighting chance to survive. All these whiney tankers who conmain about “one-shots” from arty? What about ARTY? What about all the games we only get to stay in the game 1-2 minutes because we get killed by light tanks that rush in? Is that fun for US?? It’s the same as being one-shotted but it happens more to us than it does to them. Please consider what I am proposing and let me know your thoughts. I love WOT but if the game is no longer fair to my ability to play arty, I will simply leave it behind .
Really dude?
Pretending to be a victim in this game?
Ofc arty is a roll of dice,but then again this game should be about high risk-high reward dont you think?
So why would you get the same credit or exp results for casually clicking once every 38 sec,when the player at the recieving end pushes his “wasd” buttons like 100 times in 38 sec,watching angles he can get shot from,evading enemy fire,having to aim in on weakspots he had to learn,having to use credits for repairkits and medkits,having to deal with fires and ammo-racks,having to stay alive while low hp,having to keep an eye on his 6th sence to know if he is spotted or not while at the same time he gets clicked by invisible ghosts like you from 700m away losing 60% of his hp just for trying to male a move……..i could go on for weeks but i guess you get my point…….
You obviously know nothing about playing artillery. I use repair & medical kits on a regular basis. I use consumables on a regular basis. I too have danger from opposing arty who,follow my tracers to ascertain my position and eliminate me. I have to reposition to get proper angles when there are obstructions…..you think we spawn and just start firing away at wide-open targets? No, that’s not how it works…..on many maps there are valleys, large rock formations, hills, mountains etc. that completely prevent arty’s ability to strike. So, you then have to move to better locations…..with a vehicle that is usually quite slow and hard to maneuver. You show your ignorance of the SPG with your comments about “casually clicking.” What about my inability to protect myself 1-on1? Is that not a disadvantage? Am I a “casual” clicker when I have to stare down a tank that has broken through the lines? And then when I score a direct hit, the tank doesn’t die…..is that fair? An 8″ howitzer shell scores a direct hit and the tank simply continues on and kills me….that’s equitable? There was no “victimization” angle in my post…..that’s in your imagination. It was pointing out the defects in the proposed changes to arty and pointing out how arty already has handicaps that would simply be made worse by the changes. It’s ludicrous to have Wargaming react to tankers crying about dying from one shot when arty often gets killed in the first 2 minutes of the game from being directly attacked by on rushing tanks….that scenario happens way more often than one shots. And here’s another fact: I have a M53/55 that has a WN8 of 1855 and my hit% is 37%. Tankers are going to bitch about artillery being OP when I hit less than 4 shots out of the 10 shots I take and that is considered a “very good” WN8? Would you like having a 37% hit rate? So nice try, but your response is inadequate to,refute what I’m saying.
“Changes made to penetration over distance, with the hope of letting slower and more heavily armed machines close the distance of engagment, failed to make any of the anticipated changes. WG will likely look into balancing the various ammunition types to achieve this in the future, after a more thorough analysis.”
… Basically what people have been asking for… like… 5 years ?
I still remember the SerB era of “hurr durr T-54 HEAT shell fine, historically accurate” Yeah… Right…
Wohoo I love the Idea of reusable comsumables, changes the game for the better so much!
And for accuracy, isnt there an algorithm to define a suitable dispersion?
I have the feeling that guns tend to be too inaccurate at times even on the live servers now … derping shots right in the ground 10 meters in front of your vehicle.