From the mildest to The most sarcastic.
Power Creep to the Max.
I’m a very cynical old Bastard but this makes even me Shake my Head in wonder at the Brass Balls of WarGaming.
Starting with the Mildest of the Reviews , The Mighty Jingles. She who must be obeyed told me to.
Two more to follow
Next DezGames.
And last Sir Foch. I love the level of sarcasm in this, and it is so JUSTIFIED.
SirFoch should be more well-known than other “unicums” since he is brutally honest and humorous while not pressing the 2 key as soon as he bounces an AMX50b with his first shot *COUGH QUICKYBABY COUGH SIRCIRCON COUGH* like seriously though SirFoch deserves so much more recognition wtf
You mean Foch has a filthy sense of humor and his M4A1 Ravioli’s premium rounds are so awful they’re not worth firing. The two of them fire premium rounds equally and your definition of honest… let’s just say you should go give a dictionary once in a while. Foch gives opinions ie the definition of “tank reviews” just like everyone else. You just happen to find his opinions somehow validate your thoughts which is why you call it the truth.
Foch is great, always nice to have a good quality of salt now and then over the more peachy videos QB might release or the lazy garbage a drunk might release. But Foch is more for long standing players that like seeing wargaming as not the successful game development company that it is. Nothing wrong with it, it’s a good past time to have a nemesis, but the majority of players are just there for the fun. Take a look at the release videos between QB and Foch and you’ll see the Foch does a lot more high tier videos than QB and almost never dips below tier 8 videos. It’s just a difference between target audience.
Here’s to more videos by Foch, the niche he fills is lovely ^^b
QB and Circon spamming gold? Hmmm, someone has yet to see an average game of Whinefield, nothing says ‘skill’ like 50-75% prem rounds loudouts.
I agree with you..this guy Foch is worth taking in consideration because he knows to say “fuck” a word that others can’t say it, because are moore well spoken and have moore common sence.
Dis you, by any chance count the number of fucks and other curses this Foch said?…the all video.
If you have a narrow ,mind to belive all the shit that he spell on his mouth than you are right this guy deserve a well earned place on the wellspoken and crazy ideea’s about wot that are around this game.(you have to be some kind retarded to belive that wg is making russians tanks better than other nation tanks)
Please do come to stream and discuss that with him,I guarantee he will be 100% up for it.
let’s sum up few major recent updates that effected balance
1) Japan heavy tanks made a lot of tanks useless, like KV-5
2) CZ tanks, 4 seconds for 1300hp, before you turn around he is on other side of map, balanced
3) LIberte and Patriot
4) Swedish tanks, either OP or BS, depends on map rotation and teams
5) “E5 is not toxic”
SirFoch may be sarcastic but guy has valid point, he is pissed off how stupid it all went, this game is going down and every step for the last 20 steps was down and now they introduce IS-7 they claimed it was a problem even on tier 10, they put that armor on T8… T6 tanks cannot pen that with gold ammo, side has russian magic armor so good luck with that, tank can safely hug any T10 tank and be as competitive as it wasn’t T8 premium.
Premium tanks were once described as bad for their tier so game does not become Pay-to-Win.
Now T9 tanks need to Pay for premium ammo to be able to do something to this, most T8 tanks should just stay away from this thing and hope arty clicks on it.
I do not see this working out for them at all
KV-5 is performing above average, wargaming has gone out right saying they over buffed the tank, premium rounds of 217 butter through the O-Ho and O-Ni if you’re not inclined to just bully the side of an O-Ho/O-Ni and simply out dpm the tanks with your best in class dpm and hit points. Believe it or not, Japanese heavies do not have the gun depression to hit the R2-D2 on the front if a KV-5 face/side hugs them.
CZ tanks, yup, light tanks are really underpowered especially at tier 8. Don’t normally see them used competitively, mostly unicums or above average players who have gotten the tank and are why you believe the tank is so strong. The same can be said about Swedish tanks, there aren’t enough tomato players who have gotten the tanks to drag down the statistics since the lines are very new and very empty that it’s much more worth your time grinding to a batchat.
Liberte, Patriot, Mutz, Skorpion, M46 KR, Lowe Buff, M4A1 Rev Buff, T34 Buff, IS-6 Buff, KV-5. The liberte and patriot are recent, yes, but this has been an on going deal. Apparently as consumers, we’ve shown we won’t buy under powered tanks.
E5 nerf planned tonight and tomorrow, you need to keep up to date with patch notes when they’re announced a month in advance.
The mutz and patton KR aren’t overpowered in any way shape or form, they are very average for their tier, which is how it should be. The T34 was underpowered and really needed the love, I feel the ravioli might have gotten a little too much, but don’t have it myself so not sure.
The big problem isn’t that the premiums are good they are straight up better than tech tree counterparts, compare e5p to the t32 or caern and it beats them in almost every category. Or the liberte to the tiger 2, its not even a competition, they are much better. Of course people wont buy underpowered tanks now premium MM is gone, which I feel is a BS excuse as WG keeps selling those limited MM tanks anyway, but that doesn’t mean they have to be OP. WG needs to either test the vehicles properly and if Community contributors conclude its too good nerf it before it goes on sale, or, what I think would be better, stop being a wussy and nerf premium tanks whenever needed. People can be pissed about it, but they agreed WG is allowed to do it, so all they could do is not spend money anymore. Id say tough luck about that, cause in the end that attracts a larger playerbase, I wouldn’t want to give you the number of players who quit (I have quite a few friends who just couldn’t be bothered because they were pretty much chanceless), because of sealclubbing in pz2j’s, pz b2’s and the likes and e25s just ruining MM, and then we are not even talking about non-premiums like the OI exp/OI.
I saw patch notes, but do you remember for how long it is like that with E5? when id they buffed it? did storm say that average wr of the tank jumped sky-high just hours after update and after that wg said tank is balanced.
and in video about this update they say they are nerfing it because players want it…..
about KV-5, I know what happened after, I just said Japanese tanks did make a mess appearing
CZ mid tiers are bs, T6 is great but now cromwel, T9 and T10 are so easy to play, pretty unfair (even stated by wg that they are unsure if they should nerf them now or wait balance 2.0 for that)
“we won’t buy underpowered tanks” – did you read last year’s wg financial report?
in any case, there is a room between underpowered and overpowered and it is called balanced – not something you can say for IS-3 (best T9 in game), Liberte, Patriot, Foch 155, TVP VTU, Panther 88, pzJ, E25 and on and on, every tank WAY out of so called balanced area.
Like WZ-111 is now decently balanced if you play it like semi-medium tank as hp/t allows shifting and you can bully other mediums while vs IS-3 either press 2 or go fuck your self.
People like OP tanks ,it makes them feel good like they did something and not just press the W-key in idiot-proof tank, like 140, like E5 up to today, like IS-7, recently Liberte, Patriot, now this thing….
WG buffs and nerfs are too rough, they play with big numbers and that’s why there is small area where tank is balanced as average “tweak” WG makes to a tank is enough to switch it from OP to BS or vice versa
While I get what they try to get with each tweak I kind of have impression they lack someone who can do math of how much impact would that thing have, it is rough math but WG misses it by a huge margin and something like that should be predicted using statistical methods but WG fails and fails again
I recommend you take a peak at the Mutz and M46 KR performances on vabbidt or any other statistics tracking site. Keep in mind these two tanks were up for rentals for weeks as part of the first major rental events. But more importantly are a lot cheaper and available for players than tier 8 heavies. The T34 wasn’t always underpowered until new premiums raised the standard power level premiums had to be at. A big problem with the T34 is that wallet warriors pick the tank up and realize it isn’t as strong tier for tier as the T29. The buffs were appreciated, don’t get me wrong, but the T34 only got them because of recent premiums and power creep.
T32, much much much stronger turret and the higher alpha, view range, side armor is an undeniable benefit. Problem is people don’t know how to aim in the T32 or snipe in the tank like it were a tiger II, you don’t need the high pen and low normalizing shots on the E5 all the time and simple alpha and bouncing tier X shells when bottom tier is very effective. Caernarvon, much more reliably accurate and view range once again. The E5 is pretty limited to close range fighting because of the shell penetration drop and normalization problems of the apcr while the Caernarvon can afford to sit back and snipe especially when bottom tier. Same can be said about the Tiger II but I’ve just found players just don’t play these tanks to their strengths. They are defensive and support heavies while the E5 and Liberte are assault heavies. You put the Liberte and E5 to fire over the shoulders of tier X heavies and you’ll find the tanks underpowered. I don’t find these tanks to outperform their counterparts just more user friendly because any idiot can drive up to cqb in them and do well while the skill level for the caernarvon and tiger actually require you know what you’re doing.
As for lower tiered and significantly older premiums like the E25, Pz b2 and J, not much I can say, wargaming really throws the low tiers out the window since most of their paying customers and income aren’t there. Not defending it, but there are probably a lot of brash game designers in wargaming that believe they understand the game fundamentally. Well, for nationalism, business, or design, someone who believes they are absolutely correct is a danger to any community.
Nerfs inbound to the O-i exp I heard, O-I is not over powered, just stubborn and dumb players think they can take it on in head on 1v1 battles. Probably could be worth taking away the heat shells because they are very random and frusterating to use, the concept of simple pay2win premium rounds is more of a universal problem and a subject of their own.
@No_Quarter, E5 had a remarkably high winrate and damage out put for its WN8 scoring, simply, the quality of games/players were low but the rewards were high. But the commander machine gun had remained buff for a little over a year I believe, the problem with balancing the E5 is that its armor has always been borderline good/bad or just exceptionally complex due to varying armor thicknesses and the unique slopping. If I were wargaming, I’d do my best to get a quality rebalance and take as much time as I needed to make sure the tank didn’t become overpowered or underpowered. With improving fidelity of rebalances, recognizing a problem becomes so much more difficult since the numbers coming in will have small and difficult to recognize changes.
Wargaming has almost never made a change because players want something, the voices were very split on the tank being balanced, over powered, etc. it’s more of a convinient skin for the action once the statistics soured in HQ and a change was decided to be needed.
KV-5 and jap tanks, yeah, the change to the game environment was a large and dynamic one.
Autoloaders are a very viable play style and interesting double edged sword, yup, mid tiers suffer from requiring good crews because of their high rof fire pea shooters or in the case of the T-34-100 and Tier 8, the skill cap is remarkably high because the tanks lack gun depression, armor, and require quick/wise repositioning. They are probably more intended for players who are looking for a challenge or content as the single nation line isn’t for beginners.
“we won’t buy underpowered tanks” – did you read last year’s wg financial report? You got me there haha
But as for the IS-3, lol, that is good man, not being sarcastic but I genuinly liked it. Some other premiums and non-premiums you listed, debatable, most of them are undeniably performing above average nonetheless. Others, well, that might just be down to your play style agreeing with them. Thuroughly entertaining read there haha, keep up the good stuff.
I’ve been in some group projects where I had conflicting images for the end goal. None of us had a bad goal in mind, but the problem was that they differed in subtle ways here and there the overal product of our work sometimes lacked luster. sometimes you wish you had a hivemind backing a project instead of so many different perspectives.
I agree with SirFoch.
Why even play
Honestly it doesn’t seem that OP IMO. That LFP is friggin HUGE, side armor seems utter shit (if you’re not stupid enough to shoot the upper, angled part of it) and the turret is quite weakspotty as well. It will be a very decent tank to play, no doubts but I don’t get all the hysteria going on about it.
Because players are confused at seeing a new tank they don’t know how to handle yet. Once everyone learns how it works and knows how to shoot, it’ll die down…
You should at least check armour profile before commenting… You can angle the tank for uniform 230+ effective frontal armour, and it can outtrade almost anything on the tier. And ofc it is premium, so you can load something like 15/10/5 and spam HEAT all day long and still make a huge profit.
It is OP. All best tanks of tier 8 are prems atm, and most of them heavily overplayed as well. This makes playing tiers 7 and 8 tanks pretty pointless, you will run into semi-decent prem ammo spammer in his prem tonk and you will die, he will still make a profit. Balanced.
With that 90mm effective stripe on the side? LOL.
its a russian version of liberte and patriot. it should be more idiot proof
Awesome epic guys made a skit similar to Foch’s into, so true.
Sirfoch is the best, the rest if dripping from too much pink honey, to much PC bullshit… Russian and belarusians simply treat kind and polite behaviour as a weakness, so pls fuck them harder, Sirfoch!!!
FFS, start spamming HE!! Hit its gun!! Track the bastard!! Why do ppl always talk about premium ammo? I know Im cheap and I dont like to spam premium, not even in the CT, but FFS, that tank isnt an E5 at tier VIII.
Nope you are right its an IS7 at tier 8.
But the IS7 is bad at t10
Good news:
+There is no thing as ‘fool proof’ in WoT. IS-3 is regarded as near OP and i still find a way to perform poorly with it.
+Judging by Dez’s video, this thing still killable.
Bad news:
-Like Foch’s said, a freaking power creep. If people haven’t convinced yet by Mle49 and T26E5 arrival, this sealed the deal.
I haven’t watched QB’s video (28 minutes? Later then) but yeah, when two review point on how ridiculous is this tank, then you better get concerned. Like someone said (Foch i think) you better not buying this to make statement to WG.
Finally finishing QB’s video and i think its really funny to see how he managed to make this tank looked… balanced.
I concede to some QB’s point that it got massive lower plate that quite circumstantial to hide, but it still rather thick for a tier 8 heavy. Side armor? City map brawling blyat.
I still think this tank is too good for a tier 8 premium.
I really appreciate what QB does for WOT, but I feel he was trying way too hard to justify how good the tank is, in most of his reviews he barely goes into how badly it performs against higher tiers, while this one he seemed to make quite a point of it. While almost any tank is poor against higher tiers.
Especially considering WG is intending to give this a small buff to its DPM and side armour, I really feel the only really honest/not politically correct review is foch, while jingles says about the same, I dislike that he says if you want it you should buy it and I feel he should take a stance against pay 2 win.
And QB does agree too, but as I said tries to make it look worse than it is or something…
Next patch they will release a Premium T-64 Protoype at Tier 8 🙂
time to refund my is6
Amount of misinformation about this tank floating around is ridiculous 😀
But alright, the more people rushing cluelessly because op op russia tonk and trying to “safely facehug tier Xs” (lol what even) with Is7 hull? (Why would we bother with tanks.gg when we can jump onto hype trains and repeat slogans) with a tier IX gun? (rotfl)
But go ahead, buy as many as you want. Gotta love tears on chat when you realize how mediocore it actually is. 😀
Mediocre against Tier X. Good luck fighting this thing with, say, a FCM 50 or an IS-3. These are the tanks you should compare it against, because they will be matched against it on a regular basis.
What exactly is the problem with fighting it in is3? And fcm Is a bad tank, which doesn’t stop it from flanking.
@Bricktop: The FCM has 1500 HP and little armour – the 252 would very likely pen him every time, for 440 av. damage. The FCM, on the other hand, has only 240 base damage. He would have to flank a healthy 252 for a long time. And while it is remarkably agile for a heavy, it is still not *that* fast, not to mention the fact that it is a large target. In short, flanking a 252 won’t be an option in most cases, but sniping won’t be much of an option, either, since the FCMs APCR will lose PEN over distance and the regular AP are unlikely to penetrate, at least from the front. In my opinion, a healthy FCM simply won’t be a match for a healthy 252 (provided the 252 is not driven by a complete potato). But because of the FCM’s preferential matchmaking it will be matched against 252 lots of times, especially since the 252s will be enormously popular (surprise surprise).
As to the IS-3, that was actually a typo – I meant the IS-6: also preferential matchmaking, very poor penetration, lacking agility to flank. But then, even the IS-3, easily the best regular Tier VIII, is simply not as good as the 252. You will now be able to buy the strongest Tier VIII in the shop. Can’t say I like it.
Oh, and another thing: The 252 is, after all, a Tier VIII tank, so it will be matched against Tier VI tanks. That’s tanks such as the M6 or the KV-85, which can easily be two-shot by the 252 – nice. It’s all good and fine to say the 252 will be mediocre against Tier X, but it might be a good idea to look that the whole picture.
Why do you want to 1v1 252 in fcm, which is a support vehicle? The way for fcm to avoid dmg is to dodge, not bounce. And everything you told about fighting 252 applies to fighting any other meta heavy (patriot, liberte, is3)
Plus, tanks with preferential matchmaking ARE terrible and it’s nothing new. You can’t reliably brawl any of meta heavies with them, so why would you be able to brawl 252?
Is6 is near useless fighting anything above tier 7. Since buff you need apcr to pen Lowe’s lower plate, so why do you expect it to pen 252?
And about that idiotic argument about tier 6s being unable to fight it frontally. Can they fight liberte frontally? Is3? Patriot? 112? Vk 45.02a after buff is going to be immune to tier 6s frontally ffs. Why would a tier 6 pen a tier 8 heavy tank frontally?
Even the beast premium rounds on the M6/T20 don’t have a hard time penning from the front. And you know Id say compare this to the ravioli or m46kr, both no prem MM, they don’t even stand a chance, you need to flank, but you are only slightly faster, the 252 can pen you really reliably.
The best comparison is to a vehicle like the IS3, or other tech tree vehicles, and the fact of the matter is statistically it is just better. More alpha, same DPM, bit worse gun handling true, but much better armour, same view range, pretty much the same mobility and then we are comparing it to the balance that is IS3…
The minute somebody calls your reasonable arguments idiotic you know he’s not interested in exchanging opinions, but in winning a pissing contest. Should have guessed from the smug tone of his first post. Of course you’re right, Bricktop, 100% in everything you say. Always.
Not to mention the poor sods that come across it in a T6 or T7. They may as well roll over and die.
But hey it can’t rofl stomp T10 so it’s fair and balanced comrade.
Dude, like really. I don’t say your argument is stupid because I have something against it. I say it’s stupid because it’s fucking stupid, objectively invalid. What can tier 6s do to an is3? 112? Patriot? Liberte? Isn’t that a problem? Why is 252’s immunity for tier 6s bad for the gameplay and is3’s not? What I see here Sir, is nitpicking and being biased. But hey, I’m the bad guy huh.
He never said its not bad those tanks are almost invulnerable either, difference is they have weakspots, that aren’t as tiny as the 252s cupola’s. And don’t trade as crazy well. Especially vs lower tiers. As I tried to explain you should compare it to same tier tanks and it is one of the if not the best tier 8 tank, probably on par with patriot and maybe IS3, skorp G and liberte.
thanks for the 2nd two videos. i’ve stopped watching jingles as his videos are always littered with a lot of incorrect information and just a poor understanding of the game
Our hero made a review too:
https://youtu.be/CcW57dl5lV0
Just think about new german heavys and Type 4 and 5 and it will look balanced since they wont give a shit about you in this tank.
It takes Sir Foch to call a spade a spade, but special cudos to Sahm Lockhart – he warned about this thing being way too overpowered long ago. Bit disappointed by DezGamez and Jingles here, but I don’t expect QB to be any better. Don’t bite the hand that feeds you, I guess.
It’s got armor from the front and shot trap on mantlet. If you shoot he the driver hatch under the gun is 50mm so either shot trap or he.
It’s a heavy try not to shoot it in the face most of the time
Yeah, right, come again, fall for the same trick for 1048475349 time! It’s the same shit as the IS-5. I own it since the first day it was introduced. They’ve ninja nerfed it 3 days after it went on live servers and the tank from absolutely astonishing became utter shit. With this abomination we’ll see the same thing- tomatos will be milked to buy extremly OP premium tonk, WC will ninja nerf it and it will end up like another useless tard- KV-4 Kreslavski.
Kv4-krev huh, I even forgot it exists since I haven’t seen any of them lately…
But yeah, even though Wot went down hill… I cant find other tanks games I like (tried AW and WT)
How exactly was it ninja-nerfed? Did they actually tweak any stats? I never had one, so I’m curious.
They nerfed its rng. Everything would bounce and you would hit even with snap shots. And then… All shells started penetrating with some bad rng and fully aimed shots at 100 meters started missing or going to god knows where and bounce.
I saw one 2 days ago and I was in my Bert (FV304)… I had fun shooting it down. Bring them on!
Come on, why the panic? Just make a comparison with te IS-3, the T-10 and the IS-6. Then you will see that the Object 252U will lag behind on almost all aspects but the armor http://beta.tanks.gg/v09171ct/compare/obj-252u?t=is-3~t-10~is-7 it’s not so OP as you think, you will be eaten alive by higher Tier tanks (as shown by QB).
In a one on one facehug situation it will be hard to kill, but in the most clashes between heavy’s there are more tanks involved and you will get penned in your sides, combined with a low DPM your garage is nearby.
As bircktop said, don’t compare it with tier 6, look at it’s position when it’s bottem tier.
IS-6 must be IS-7 ofcourse
You shouldn’t compare them to bottom tier, you should compare them to same tier, cause if you compare them to bottom tier you can pretty much as well give all the tanks in tier 8 270 pen, cause you know else it wont be able to perform very reliably vs tier 10.
Like give me one tank that will take longer to kill by tier 10s? Exactly not a single one, yeah the t32 when hulldown, but that sacrifices almost everything else. I really don’t understand how it is an argument, yeah it isn’t very good vs higher tier tanks, so meh not very good tank, meanwhile look at a mod 1 that only performs well against lower tier tanks, and that is considered balanced too, while it has much less armour only slightly more mobility, a worse gun and more importantly pretty much useless against anything tier 9, it even struggles against IS3s and the likes.
Don’t forget the ammo count!
It’s sold on the russian server now, so live gameplay will be doen now.
DPM =1760 4 shots/minute so reload will be 15 sec.
Russian youtubers seem to be less enthusiastic. Some even call 252U garbage. Not sure if it’s because they secretly hope that WG will listen and buff it even more.
You see…. Over rated. My guess a good heavy, fun to play.
Listening what Russian youtubers have to say seems like not a reliable truth, as either WG has a Russian bias or their Russian community/community contributors have a Russian bias.
Maybe Russians can’t play?
I love Jingles, but god it was painful to watch him play so bad 😛
This thing is well balanced according to some youtubers. While the new guns on the Types are OP. Can it have something to do with the fact that the types are too slow and large for their taste.. Somehow I don’t see them struggle against it in their autoloaders and mediums.
Arrogance, entitlement and selfishness.
The new guns are very good, maybe at this moment a little OP, but the future role of armor will increase (sandbox). So there is a need for better guns.
From the WoT RU premium shop description, translated;
“Meet the new Soviet heavy tank level VIII – ‘Object 252U’! This newcomer is able not only to repel the old-timers in the game, but also to begin to dictate their conditions.”
By this, WG admits it simply smears the competition. I was considering picking up a patriot earlier, but decided against it ( only other premiums are the super p and 59 patton). With this thing being released, wondering if I should buy the next e25 or wait until WG puts the 279 as a tier 6 premium.
The good thing is that with tanks like this no-one can in their right mind say anything along the lines that arty is either OP or unfair to play against. But, even I know that the quality and quantity of whine against this tank will pale in comparison to that against arty. Hypocrisy will abound.
I stopped watching Sir Foch at the point he says the lower plate would be very easy to hide…
He bored me ages ago on a tank review and never been back
252 is almost immune to tier 10 guns while sidescraping its almost immune to tier 10 guns while facehugging it will outtrade all at its tier but the strongest tds in alpha it has similar mobility as Is 3 that cannot be circled by most mediums it is perfect for all the canyon maps wargaming implemented in the last years also “redesigning” older maps into canyon style so you will find usefull spots in this tank every game
but it will also perform good on open maps because it wont get forced into cover by enemie guns so easily and also because it laughes about artie even more than the Is 3 is doing already because of armor layout
it probably can be usefull as second line sniper similar to an IS 3 but probably better because the incoming damage will be going against zero and dont tell me to aim at the copula after the acuracy rebalances you can be happy to even hit the turret from over 100 metres with leopard 1 like guns
I seriously see no point in that being not overpowered
Is 3 is often called tier 9 tank but against this it looks like a piece of junk
give 2 or 3 of these in a tier 8 top tier matchmaking while you get some other shit maybe the liberty or patriot excluded and you ll loose with a very high chance and that in a very fast way
Maybe play some very mobile shit like a
vk d 2 get yourself some teammates with similar tanks and pray to the gods you can isolate and suprise an greedy and incapable 252 maybe you can shot him down then while circling or if not at least being able to run away from it as fast as possible
Or you’re smart you wait for it to push or go around the map and shoot it in the butt. It’s good from the front. Circling it to death might be hard but you can beat it. That’s the key thing. You can beat and send this to the garage. Btw the liberte doesn’t have enough frontal armor against tier x plus you have to be straight on to use the armor at all because the back and sides are terrible. Plus no side scrape with the 80mm corners.
Patriot is the odd one as it’s so much better than the t32. Only reason I won’t buy it. I hope I can buy the 252u as I actually like the design while the is6 looks hideous. Looks matter to me